Principe Ottomani (de Sayd), 1492, Visconte Ottomani (Sayd) 1509. and other acknowledgements.
Cem was the younger brother of Sultan Bayezid. When Mehmet the Conqueror had died, Bayezid was the governor of Sivas , Tokat and Amasya, Cem ruled the province of Karaman and Konya . Karamani Mehmet Pasha the last grand vizier of Sultan Mehmet II sent two messengers to both of the shehzades just after the death of Sultan. But the messenger sent to Cem had been caught on the way by Sinan Pasha the Anatolia Deputy. Cem could have learnt his father’s death four days later. The Yeniceris revolted and killed Karamani Mehmet Pasha as a result of this event. They enthroned Korkut the son of Bayezid as the regent (May,4 1481). Prince Bayezid arrived Istanbul on 21st May 1481 and was declared Sultan. Cem on the other hand arrived Inegol on 27th May 1481 with his 4000 soldiers. Sultan Bayezid sent an army led by Ayas Pasha on Cem. On 28th May 1481 Cem had defeated Bayezid’s army and he declared himself Sultan of Anatolia and made his capital Bursa . He proposed division of the empire, with ayezid ruling only Europe . Bayezid rejected the proposal, of course, defending the continued unity of the Ottoman State . He marched through Bursa and the decisive battle between the two took place near Yenisehir. Cem lost the battle and took refuge in the Mameluke State with his family. He went to Cairo .
In Cairo Cem has received a letter from his brother. In this letter, Beyazid offered Cem one million akces(Ottoman money) in order to dissuade from the throne. Cem rejected this offer and came to his homeland. On 27th May 1482 he besieged Konya . The Ottoman Army commanded by Sultan Bayezid went to Konya , Cem ended the siege and withdrew to Ankara . He was intending to go to Cairo again but all the ways had been kept by Bayezid. Meanwhile, Pierre d’Aubusson one of the Knights of Rhodes invited Cem to Rhodes .
On 29th June 1482 Cem went to Rhodes . He was planning to leave the island in a short time, and he made an agreement with the knights about his departure. But, the knights had deceived him and they did not permit him to depart from the island. Cem began to live a prisoner’s life in Rhodes . Eventually, this was very unfortunate for Cem himself and for the Ottoman Empire .
Afterwards, Cem was sent to France . Sultan Bayezid sent a messenger to France and requested Cem to be kept there.
Pope Innocent VIII intended to organise a new crusade using Cem. But, he could not had been successful as the other European countries rejected. He offered Cem to convert to Christianity. Cem of course rejected this offer. Afterwards, the Pope had taken more than 40.000 gold annual, from Bayezid for Cem’s expenses. The Ottoman Empire had stopped the campaigns as the Pope threatening them with Cem’s liberation.
After all these events, Cem Sultan had died in February 25, 1495. Sultan Bayezid declared national mourning for three days. He also tried to take Cem’s body from the Pope, but, four years later after Cem’s death his body was brought to the Ottoman lands. He was buried in Bursa .
Updated: 30-03-2024;.
Granted to: Prince Djem of the Ottoman Empire.
- Title: Principe Ottomani.
By: Pierre d’Aubusson, Grand Master of St John of Rhodes Island
On: 1482 at Rhodes Island.
Presented to the British Royal Commission on Nobility: No.
With Remainder to: Nil, extinct 1495.
Granted to: Prince Djem of the Ottoman Empire.
- Title: Principe Ottomani.
By: Charles VIII, King of France
On: 1484 at Rome, Papal States.
Presented to the British Royal Commission on Nobility: No.
With Remainder to: Singularly to all the descendants of Principe Mehmed Sayd in the male primogenial line born in the Christian faith.
List of Title holders: Direct line;
1. Prince Pierre Mehmed Sayd of the Ottoman Empire, 1st Prince e Visconte de Sayd., died 1522 Rhodes Island. succeeded by eldest son.
2. Prince Oshin Pierre Sayd, 2nd Prince e Visconte de Sayd, died 1594 Naples, succeeded by eldest son.
3. Prince Oshin Pierre II Sayd, 3rd Prince e Visconte de Sayd, died 1600 Naples, succeeded by younger brother.
4. Prince John Battista Sayd, 4th Prince e Visconte de Sayd, 1st Prince di Bibino Magno., died 1602 Sicily, succeeded by eldest son.
5. Prince Oshin III Carlo Sayd, 5th Prince e Visconte de Sayd, 2nd Prince di Bibino Magno, died 1653 Mdina Malta, succeeded by eldest son.
6. Prince Jean Pierre Sayd, 6th Prince e Visconte de Sayd, 3rd Prince di Bibino Magno, died 1671 Sicily, succeeded by brother.
7. Prince Oshin IV Jerome Sayd, 7th Prince e Visconte de Sayd, 4th Prince di Bibino Magno, died 1679 Rome, succeeded by Ist Cousin.
8. Prince Pierre Djem Sayd Ruffo, 8th Prince e Visconte de Sayd, died 1683 Palermo Sicily, extinct 1683.
Granted to: Prince Pierre Mehmed of the Ottoman Empire.
- Title: Principe Ottomani, later de Sayd.
By: Pope Alexander VI Borgia.
On: 1492 at Rome, Papal States.
Presented to the British Royal Commission on Nobility: No.
With Remainder to: Singularly to all the descendants of Principe Mehmed Sayd in the male primogenial line born in the Christian faith. According to the Letters Patent, only those born within the marriage in the Church of Rome and within the vows of marriage to ensure that true christian lineage continues from the legacy given to a friend and convert to the Church of Rome. This applies to the Prince Djem’s son Pierre Mehmed and his descendants in the order of Primogeniture.
Further, the Church of Rome extends its ruling that if a child is born before one’s parents marriage and is baptised will not be entitled to succeed. Pope Alexander VI clearly marked this in the letter’s patent dated November 1492. To continue the lineal line of senior descent of Principe Djem Ottomani according to the orginal conversion acts set by Pope Alexander VI upon acceptance of onto the Church of Rome.
It is very clear that no descendants can style Prince or Princess due to the christian faith conversion over the generations, hence the exclusion from the Ottoman line of succession. This was also noted in a letter from the late HIH, Osman V, 43rd Head of the house of Osman.
No further applications to extend or change the original patent in Rome, today any future changes must only be accepted by the papacy only.
Granted to: Prince Djem of the Ottoman Empire.
- Title: Principe and Hereditary Knight of the Holy Roman Empire.
By: Frederick III, Holy Roman Emperor
On: 1492 at Vienna, Austria.
Presented to the British Royal Commission on Nobility: No.
With Remainder to: Singularly to all the descendants of Principe Mehmed Sayd in the male primogenial line born in the Christian faith.
Extinct after the last legitimate male died in 1683.
** List of Title holders: Direct line –
1. Prince Pierre Mehmed Sayd of the Ottoman Empire, 1st Prince e Visconte de Sayd., died 1522 Rhodes Island. succeeded by eldest son.
2. Prince Oshin Pierre Sayd, 2nd Prince e Visconte de Sayd, died 1594 Naples, succeeded by eldest son.
3. Prince Oshin Pierre II Sayd, 3rd Prince e Visconte de Sayd, died 1600 Naples, succeeded by younger brother.
4. Prince John Battista Sayd, 4th Prince e Visconte de Sayd, 1st Prince di Bibino Magno., died 1602 Sicily, succeeded by eldest son.
5. Prince Oshin III Carlo Sayd, 5th Prince e Visconte de Sayd, 2nd Prince di Bibino Magno, died 1653 Mdina Malta, succeeded by eldest son.
6. Prince Jean Pierre Sayd, 6th Prince e Visconte de Sayd, 3rd Prince di Bibino Magno, died 1671 Sicily, succeeded by brother.
7. Prince Oshin IV Jerome Sayd, 7th Prince e Visconte de Sayd, 4th Prince di Bibino Magno, died 1679 Rome, succeeded by Ist Cousin.
8. Prince Pierre Djem Sayd Ruffo, 8th Prince e Visconte de Sayd, died 1683 Palermo Sicily, extinct 1683.
Granted to: Prince Pierre Mehmed of the Ottoman Empire.
- Title: Visconte de Sayd.
By: Ferdinando III, King of Naples.
On: 1509 at Naples, Kingdom of Naples.
Presented to the British Royal Commission on Nobility: No.
With Remainder to: Singularly to all the descendants of Principe Mehmed Sayd in the male primogenial line born in the Christian faith.
List of Title holders: Direct line ;
1. Prince Pierre Mehmed Sayd of the Ottoman Empire, 1st Prince e Visconte de Sayd., died 1522 Rhodes Island. succeeded by eldest son.
2. Prince Oshin Pierre Sayd, 2nd Prince e Visconte de Sayd, died 1594 Naples, succeeded by eldest son.
3. Prince Oshin Pierre II Sayd, 3rd Prince e Visconte de Sayd, died 1600 Naples, succeeded by younger brother.
4. Prince John Battista Sayd, 4th Prince e Visconte de Sayd, 1st Prince di Bibino Magno., died 1602 Sicily, succeeded by eldest son.
5. Prince Oshin III Carlo Sayd, 5th Prince e Visconte de Sayd, 2nd Prince di Bibino Magno, died 1653 Mdina Malta, succeeded by eldest son.
6. Prince Jean Pierre Sayd, 6th Prince e Visconte de Sayd, 3rd Prince di Bibino Magno, died 1671 Sicily, succeeded by brother.
7. Prince Oshin IV Jerome Sayd, 7th Prince e Visconte de Sayd, 4th Prince di Bibino Magno, died 1679 Rome, succeeded by Ist Cousin.
8. Prince Pierre Djem Sayd Ruffo, 8th Prince e Visconte de Sayd, died 1683 Palermo Sicily, succeeded by 2nd Cousin once removed.
Claimants and deJure style – “Never obtain recognition from the Grand Master of Malta or the King of Sicily, so it was pretense style only”
** (Eldest legitimate through a female line after resignations): –
Head of the Family and Heir to No 4.
9. Don Salvatore Sayd, 9th Prince e Visconte de Sayd, died 1699 Santi Malta, succeeded by eldest son.
10. Don Simone Sayd, 10th Prince e Visconte de Sayd, 6th Prince di Bibino Magno, died at Santi, Malta, succeeded by eldest son.
11. Don Lorenzo Sayd, 11th Prince e Visconte de Sayd, 7th Prince di Bibino Magno, died at Santi, Malta, succeeded by eldest Son.
12. Don Giovanni Maria Said, 12th Prince e Visconte de Sayd, 8th Prince di Bibino Magno, Executed by Napoleon 1799, succeeded by eldest son.
13. Don Salvatore II Said, 13th Prince e Visconte de Sayd, 9th Prince di Bibino Magno, died at Santi, Malta, succeeded by eldest son.
14. Don Giovanni Maria Said, 14th Prince e Visconte de Sayd, 10th Prince di Bibino Magno, died 1907 Santi, Malta, succeeded by eldest legitimate son.
15. Don Francesco Saverio Said, 15th Prince e Visconte de Sayd, 11th Prince di Bibino Magno, died 1956 Santi, Malta, succeeded by his second Son as eldest renounced before migrating to Australia.
16, Don Carmelo Said, 16th Prince e Visconte de Sayd, 12th Prince di Bibino Magno, died 1973 Mgarr Malta, succeeded by eldest son.
17. Don Giuseppe Said, 17th Prince e Visconte de Sayd, 13th Prince di Bibino Magno, (born 1949-.
Heir: Conte Charles Said-Vassallo, (1971-.
2. Don David A. Said, (1975-.
3. Don Joel I. Said, (2005-.
4. Don Darcy D. Said, (2009-.
5. Don Angelo Said, (1952-.
6. Don Matthew Said, (1976-.
7. Don Joachim Said, (2001-.
8. Don Aaron Said, (2004-.
9. Don Ryan Said, (2008-.
10. Don Daniel Said, (1981-.
Claimants (illegitimate line). (Eldest illegitimate through a female line): –
(15) Conte Salvatore Said, De-Jure 15th Prince e Visconte de Sayd, De-Jure Prince of Bibino Magno, died 1923 Cairo, Egypt, succeeded by his eldest son.
(16) Conte Enrico Said, De-Jure 16th Prince e Visconte de Sayd, De -Jure Prince of Bibino Magno, died 1944 Paris, France, succeeded by his eldest son.
(17) Conte Salvatore Said, De-Jure 17th Prince e Visconte de Sayd, De-Jure Prince of Bibino Magno, died 1945 Paris, France, succeeded by his Uncle.
(18) Conte Riccardo Said, De-Jure 18th Prince e Visconte de Sayd, De-Jure Prince of Bibino Magno, died 1952 Paris, France, succeeded by his son.
(19) Conte Louis Said, De-Jure 19th Prince e Visconte de Sayd, De-Jure Prince of Bibino Magno, died 1991, Paris, France, succeeded by his son.
(20) Conte Ricard Said, De-Jure 20th and Last Prince e Visconte de Sayd, De-Jure Prince of Bibino Magno, died 2010, Paris, France. His line is extinct.
Claimants – Senior Line. senior line from Don Giovanni Maria Sayd, (d. 1799) who was executed by the French. ((Eldest legitimate through a female line even after resignation of main claims): –
(12). Don Lorenzo Francesco Sayd, (1781-), styled 12th Barone di Bibino Magno, 12th Visconte de Sayd, succeeded by his son.
(13). Don Giovanni Said, (c. 1870), styled 13th Barone di Bibino Magno, 13th Visconte de Sayd, succeeded by his son.
(14). Don Carmelo Said, (d. 1940), styled 14th Barone di Bibino Magno, 14th Visconte de Sayd, succeeded by his son.
(15). Don Harry John Said, (d. March, 2019), styled 15th Barone di Bibino Magno, 15th Visconte de Sayd, succeeded briefly by his son.
(16). Don Paul Gerard Said, (d. August, 2019), styled 16th Barone di Bibino Magno, 16th Visconte de Sayd, succeeded by his son.
(17). Don Jayden Paul Said, (1989-., styled 17th Barone di Bibino Magno, 17th Viconte de Sayd.
Heir: (Uncle) ; Don Mark Andrew Said, (1961-.
Articles relating to this title:
1. History of the Principe Ottomani family descent;
2. Main family of Djem and his direct male heirs:
3. The Sayd family from 17th century to present day.
4. The Hospitaller Knights of Saint John at Rhodes, 1306-1522, by Gordon Ellyson Abercrombie, 2024, pp 300-301.
